From Lawyer to CHRO: How Dual Roles Create Better Leaders with Joshua Horenstein

What happens when one executive combines legal expertise with human resources leadership? Joshua Horenstein, Senior Vice President, Chief Legal and Human Resources Officer & Corporate Secretary at Innophos, reveals the powerful advantages of his dual role in this fascinating conversation.

Leading both legal and HR departments for a global phosphate company with 1,500 employees worldwide, Joshua leverages his unique position to provide comprehensive solutions that traditional, siloed departments often miss. "Running both departments has made me better at both functions," he explains. "It made me a better lawyer, a better executive, a better leader overall."

Throughout his 15-year tenure at InnoFOS, Joshua has navigated significant corporate transitions, including a $1 billion public-private sale. His cross-functional perspective proved invaluable during these pivotal moments, allowing him to address both the structural aspects of transactions and their human impacts simultaneously. "CEOs and boards like just having one person to talk to," he notes, highlighting how his multifaceted role streamlines executive communication.

Beyond his formal responsibilities, Joshua also leads the company's ESG initiatives with a practical approach that balances environmental and social objectives with business performance. "I refuse to believe you can't be a good environmental steward and also make money," he asserts, though he acknowledges this equilibrium requires thoughtful effort rather than pursuing ESG initiatives for their own sake.

Mentorship represents another cornerstone of Joshua's leadership philosophy. Drawing from mentors who shaped his own career, he's implemented innovative programs at InnoFOS, including an English-Spanish buddy system connecting employees across different regions—strengthening both language skills and cross-cultural collaboration.

For professionals navigating their own system transformations, Joshua offers this wisdom: "Plan...but part of that humility is recognizing it's never going to go 100 percent to plan." This balanced perspective—thorough preparation paired with adaptive flexibility—defines his approach to leadership challenges in today's complex corporate landscape.

Connect with Joshua on LinkedIn to continue the conversation about cross-functional leadership and how breaking down departmental silos can create more effective executive leadership.

Chapters

• 0:00 Show Introduction
• 1:03 Meet Joshua Hornstein
• 3:40 Managing Dual Roles as CLO and CHRO
• 7:48 Navigating Corporate Sale as Dual Executive
• 12:52 Getting Heard at the Top Table
• 20:11 ESG Leadership Approach
• 26:28 Mentorship & Employee Development
• 30:19 Connecting & Episode Closing

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:03

Welcome to the HR Chat Show, one of the world's most downloaded and shared podcasts designed for HR pros, talent execs, tech enthusiasts and business leaders. For hundreds more episodes and what's new in the world of work, subscribe to the show, follow us on social media and visit hrgazettecom and visit HRGazettecom.

Speaker 2: 0:30

Welcome to another episode of the HR Chat Show. Hello listeners, this is your host today, Bill Bannum, and joining me on the show today is Joshua Hornstein, Senior Vice President, Chief Legal and Human Resource Officer and Corporate Secretary over at InnoFOS. Josh, welcome to the show today. How are you doing?

Speaker 3: 0:46

Doing great. Phil, Thank you for having me on. What a treat.

Speaker 2: 0:50

Before we go any further, just a shout out to our mutual friend, jeff Wold, who put us in contact. Josh, as we like to do on this show, why don't you start by taking a couple of minutes and introducing yourself to our listeners, telling them a bit about yourself, your passions, your career background and what gets you up in the morning?

Speaker 3: 1:08

Thanks, Bill. So once again, thank you to all the listeners. I really appreciate being on. As Bill mentioned, I'm a Senior Vice President of Legal and of HR at InnoFOS, which is a phosphate company. We are based in New Jersey, near princeton, new jersey, but we have facilities all throughout the world in canada, us, mexico. We have a facility in china as well. We have employees all over the globe also. We make specialty ingredients for all different applications, mainly in the food industry, but also in technical areas. So if you go to a supermarket in the US and you go down the middle aisles, most cases the food in that aisle so packaged good, baked good, frozen good has some sort of phosphates in it. It's either from us or one of our competitors. So it's a really neat business.

Speaker 3: 2:04

I've been here for about 15 years, so I started out. I'm a lawyer by training. I started working in the legal department, but I was very ambitious and worked hard and was promoted, and promoted, and promoted until I got to the head of the legal department. They decided I wasn't busy enough, so they put me in charge of the HR department and then they put a few other departments under me as well and it's really been a great time, great experience, great development over these 15 years in NFS great company, really important part of the overall you know food supply and business area, and so it's it's been a really great business.

Speaker 3: 2:45

I am more personally. I grew up and I live outside the Philadelphia area, so I'm a rabid Philadelphia sports fan. I live in the area of I like to analyze it to your viewers in Europe or Canada it's the closest thing I've ever seen to an English soccer fan or English football fan Philadelphia fan and so a big fan of Philadelphia Phillies and Eagles as well. And that's a little bit about me. I, like I said, I've been a lawyer by training and an executive here. I worked at a few law firms before coming to NFAS in 2010.

Speaker 4: 3:28

Thanks for listening to this episode of the HR Chat Podcast. If you enjoy the audio content we produce, you'll love our articles on the HR Gazette. Learn more at hrgazettecom. And now back to the show.

Speaker 2: 3:41

Now back to the show. Just before we hit record, I said to you, Josh, I don't think I've you know, as we were recording this today, we're about to hit episode 800 on the HR Chat Show, but I don't think I've ever interviewed anyone who's a chief legal officer and a CHRO. That's a couple of impressive hats to wear at the same time. How has holding both of those roles influenced your leadership style and your decision making?

Speaker 3: 4:10

So I usually start off with a joke about it and I say the best part about being the head of legal and head of HR is if you have a problem with legal, go talk to the head of HR, and if you have a problem with HR, go talk to the head of legal. If you have a problem with HR, go talk to the head of lead. And so it's been a really great experience in blending those two. You know really important functions and being able to draw out the cross-functional synergies with both departments. You know, in terms of my leadership style and you know how I kind of run the departments, I found that running both departments has made me better at both functions, right. So it actually made me a better lawyer, it made me a better executive, it makes me a better leader overall for the company by having that kind of cross-function and global experience. There's a lot of nuance to it and a lot of complexity, but if you're someone who enjoys that type of work and that type of multitasking and being able to solve problems on different levels and at different perspectives, and you love learning a different approach to a problem or a solution, this is a really great role for someone to take on. I really believe that having the legal background is so important in the CHRO world, not because you want to have a legal approach to every HR issue, but it just gives you that confidence and the kind of analytical thinking that gives you that secondary thinking of how you address you know an HR problem. So you know when I'm looking at compensation I don't have to worry about is my compensation plan legal? I already know that. I kind of have that psychological background already to it and then I can attack the compensation issue at hand. So if we're regrading roles or I'm trying to make sure pay is equitable between different groups, it really helps to have that double cross-functional approach.

Speaker 3: 6:08

And then on the HR side, from being a lawyer, it helps you focus your different skill sets. So if you think about just some basic skill sets there, so persuading someone a lawyer learns a way of arguing, a way of making your case. But having an HR perspective on it gives you a whole other aspect to it. It makes you more human obviously. It makes you more kind of narrowed down on what's really practical and what's important to people from a personal level. And then it also makes you more reasonable. You know reasonableness is one of those skill sets I think people always say I'm working on, or people say I always try to be reasonable or try to be practical.

Speaker 3: 6:53

But having that HR background, having that HR perspective, where you have to deal with different employees from different parts of the US or parts of Canada or parts of Mexico around around the world and then have to tailor your solutions based on that HR kind of support service, it makes you such a better lawyer, makes you such a better executive, having all those skill sets all in one. So I agree, I think it's a unique skill set. I'm always a little tickled of how people think it's so unique, because it comes so naturally to me that these two functions should be kind of working in unison, and so I really enjoy the day-to-day on this. Every day is a new challenge and every day is something very interesting to work on. I've never had a day where it's just I'm doing the same thing over and over. I always find a new, interesting approach to what we're trying to tackle here at the company.

Speaker 2: 7:51

And let's hope that you get two pay packets, given that you're doing two jobs. So you helped Leeds Interfos through a $1 billion publicprivate sale. Can you now take a couple of minutes and talk us through a few of the HR and the legal complexities of that kind of transition and your role in helping to keep teams engaged throughout that process?

Speaker 3: 8:18

So, yeah, so, the sale of my company. We were purchased by a private equity firm about five years ago. We were a public company before that time, purchased by a private equity firm about five years ago. We were a public company before that time period, for a long time, or the entire portion of my tenure before that, and so that transition was a very important and obviously very challenging transition to go through. You know, having both functions, I like to say, helped tremendously as we went through the aspects of that.

Speaker 3: 8:51

As the CLO or Chief Legal Counsel for the company, you have to start from the beginning. You're advising the CEO and the board as you put the company up for sale, as you look at with your investment bankers and looking at all the different strategic approaches to selling a company. So you're already in there and that your legal training teaches you to be inquisitive, think about what aspects of the sale are gonna be challenges or what are the opportunities there, and so you're always looking for the kind of the risks and the operational. How do you get it done? How do you get the results go out and announce the sale? How do you work on the agreements? How do you do the diligence? You know all of those issues. The hr part of it gives you that human aspect to it. So you know what's going to happen with the executives on their comp. You, you know exactly what's going to happen with the employees. You, you know where the challenges would be for a buyer of uh. You know what, how the employees would react to a sale of the company. And so having all of that kind of focus together in that one role, it's like a one-stop shop. It makes you more efficient, makes you more valuable to the company.

Speaker 3: 10:05

As you go through that, I used to, I like to say, with the CEOs and the boards that I've worked with, I think they like just having one person to talk to. Nobody wants to have an extra meeting if they don't have to, right? You can just talk to me about the legal and the HR issues and we can focus very clearly on what needs to get done right. And so having that role really helped as we were getting to sell the company and then transition to the new buyers. And I think the greatest evidence of that is, you know, for me personally is how I've been with the company through multiple transitions like this. I'm working with my third CEO since I've been at Interfas, you know, with a different board through the transition transition, and so I've really been able to leverage that kind of expertise with multiple different stakeholders and then be able to find what they needed and answer and solve their solutions, as opposed to just being kind of rigid and this is what we do and there's no changing it right.

Speaker 3: 11:09

Having that cross-functional approach teaches you you have to be nimble, you have to be creative, you have to understand what your stakeholders want and solve their problem, not your problem and so find the solution that they're looking for, even if you think it may not be the right approach for the company, but persuading them that they need to change their approach a little bit, but then also be open to I need to think about it in a different way, because the new stakeholder has a new approach that they want to take the company and so you have to really be nimble.

Speaker 3: 11:41

And that cross-functional CHRO Chief Legal Officer really gives you kind of the footing and the background for that you do. A foundation for how you approach that you know whatever the challenge is, it's your side foundation for how you put. That you know whatever the challenge is. As you're signing up, I'm happy to say we did.

Speaker 3: 12:03

I think we did a very good transition in terms of moving the company from a public to a private. It was a very successful sale of the company the company that owns us now. I think we've done a great job of keeping the business going forward and improving the business, and so that's the best evidence of doing a great job, of keeping the business going forward and improving the business, and so that's the best evidence of doing a good job on a transition is that the company keeps moving forward during that transition and, you know, even through different executives or different employee groups and different strategies for the business, we've been able to really run this successful business through all of those transitions. Having that dual CHRO chief legal officer really is invaluable in those types of businesses.

Speaker 2: 12:42

Okay, thank you. I think you said in your answer there that you have had three different CEOs during your nine years during your tenure at the company. Um, I often talk to folks on this show uh, very senior hr leaders who say, bill, it's hard to be heard at the top levels, it's hard to get a seat at the table, so to speak. Do you find, josh, because you've got this dual role, this legal aspect to you, as well as a more more traditional HR piece, that actually is easier to be heard at the top table?

Speaker 3: 13:21

Yeah, absolutely. I mean just from a basic. You know, quantity perspective right, I bring more to the table. When I'm talking to a CEO, right, I bring the legal expertise and I bring the CHRO expertise right, I bring the you know, over time now I've also bring the institutional expertise right. So if you think about it from the CEO perspective or from the board perspective, when you're talking to me and I have both these roles, I'm like a fountain of information, right, I'm a fountain of what the company is doing. And then as you work with me and as you engage with me and you see how I try and meld, you know, a practical solution between both departments and I really do not the. They love hearing that you can kind of meld the problem, find the solution, get it done efficiently and know what you're talking about right. And that's the, that's the beauty of these roles, right, you can if you do it right, if you put in the hard work to learn the different functions, if you are challenging all of your counterparts and your colleagues and what they're doing and bring your expertise to the table. It's a really nice thing to watch With the different CEOs.

Speaker 3: 14:46

I think it's one of the reasons I've lasted through all of these different transitions is because it's different personalities. It's different strategic transitions is because you know it's different personalities. It's different strategic visions for the company, right, and that's all good stuff. Um, you know, a ceo always has their strengths and their weaknesses, right. Just like you know, I have my strengths and my weaknesses. But being able as a chro and a chief legal officer to bring the information start out out, I'm a great resource. Then working with them, asking them what they want to do and trying to figure out how my expertise and my information sources help them get to where they need to get to, and then having that you know background of having to deal with all these cross-functional problems and they can see right away that I try and find a cross-functional, reasonable solution.

Speaker 3: 15:34

I don't pretend to have all the answers and that's kind of what you learn when you take both roles right. You have to be humble, especially as a lawyer who is trained to kind of have all those answers right. You're supposed to know the law inside and out. You're supposed to, you know, be kind of give that gravitas to the role. When you take on the other role of a CHRO, you have to be a little bit humble in saying I need to learn what benefits is. I need to learn what comp is right. I need to. You know, see what my HRS system. I can't just be a user of it, I have to be an expert on it, right, or know enough about it to be able to weigh in on these topics. But once you get past that kind of learning curve in the beginning, you really bring a valuable resource right.

Speaker 3: 16:16

It's, you know, having all that expertise and just being able to talk to that one person kind of puts the CEO at ease. They have lots of challenges to deal with the CEO to begin with, right, they have to come in and set a vision for the company. They're responsible for the results. You know that's the person who's ultimately responsible for seeing the company. They do not want to spend tons and tons of time trying to figure out the legal and the HR issues. They are important. They want to make sure they get done. But they want to learn. They want to focus on the commercial aspects or the operational aspects and know that you're there to help them and be strategic in your solutions. It's just there.

Speaker 3: 17:01

It's a great thing to watch, right? I can't I don't pretend to say that it's easy. Right, it's, it's a. You have to put in the hard work. You have to, you know, really challenge yourself, and then you have to be willing to fail every once in a while. You know, make a bad decision because you took some risk. But even when you fail, if you present it in a way of this is where I was trying to get to I realized I made that wrong turn. But I realized it's so much quicker because I had both departments, whereas if you only have one department, you may not realize you made a bad turn for twice as long. It helps you head it off at the pass. Have one department, you may not realize you made a bad turn for, you know, twice as long, right, it helps you head it off at the pass.

Speaker 3: 17:41

One of my favorite sayings I actually learned it from our environmental teams over the years is you know, taking, you know or finding out what your reasonable worst case scenarios are, as opposed to your worst case scenarios. Right, everybody knows where the worst case scenario is. You can talk about all the tremendous things that can go wrong, right. But if you can narrow that down to what's the reasonable worst case, right. So you can kind of set the guardrails on what your, your decision making is. That's so much more valuable than saying, oh, if the world came to an end, here's what would happen if we made this decision. If you can give them that like, here's the 80 or 90% chance of what's going to happen, and then here's the 10 or 20%, but that's not reasonable. What's within the 80 or 90 is the reasonable. Ceos love that, in my opinion. They love hearing what's their guard wells and how do you keep minimizing and bringing that risk profile down, but not in a way where you try and eliminate the risk, which is impossible.

Speaker 3: 18:36

So I could go on and on, bill. There are so many different aspects to how you can address that, but I think the main takeaway from this is you start with you have a great information resource because you know all the departments. You've learned from running these departments. You get that foundation of readjusting your thinking, your approach. Your decision-making becomes better. You get better answers, better solutions, and then you present your board or your executive team with I want to do what you want to do and I'm trying to get you there. And I'm trying to get you there, and because I have this knowledge and because I have this practical approach, even when I say we can't quite do it the way you want to do it, but we can do it a little bit different, I you know, eight times out of 10, nine times out of 10, I can persuade them that this little tweak to what they're doing makes it so much better. And that's, you know, again, that's the sweet spot, that's, that's, that's the fun in the job.

Speaker 2: 19:35

I love that. So work hard, but also have the humility to recognize that you're not going to get everything perfect every time. But show people that you are working towards that and you'll rise up the ladder and you'll be a success. There we go, hey. Sometimes in these episodes I like to switch things up and I like to challenge people. I'm going to do that right now. I'm going to ask you, in 60 seconds or less, Josh, to give us some insights around the fact that you've revamped HR systems worldwide, from HIS to payroll to compensation. In your previous answer, you mentioned that you had to become an expert in HRS, for example. In 60 seconds or less, Josh, what advice do you have for other senior HR leaders out there taking on large scale systems transformations? Go?

Speaker 3: 20:27

I would say two things. First is plan. You know you have to do the prep work when you're integrating or creating a new system. And then the second part is part of that humility you have to recognize that it's never going to go 100 percent to plan Right. So you need to prepare, not just how you're going to do it and every step in the process. You need to prepare that one of those steps is not going to come out exactly how you want it. So if you prepare on both aspects and then you are ready for the challenge, even for the things you have no idea what's going to come up, that unexpected challenge that is how you will get, you will have the most success in creating a system.

Speaker 3: 21:06

Back to the pivot on what we were talking about. When you come and take on a new function, like I did, I had to prep, I did the best I could, but then I also had to be prepared. I didn't know everything I needed to know, or I didn't know it from the beginning. So I had to prepare and be able to not fall, you know, not go to pieces when that unexpected comes up. I think that was under a minute. Did I make it? I think so.

Speaker 2: 21:31

I think you did. You just made that very good work. Okay, let's talk about ESG environmental, social and governance. That's becoming a key focus area for many organizations, and rightfully so, in my opinion. What inspired you, josh, to create and lead the ESG function over at InnoVoss, and what have been your biggest learnings so far?

Speaker 3: 21:55

So I think one of the things when you take on the CHRO and the chief legal officer role or this multi, you kind of people start to think of you as, oh, he can do this next department or he can do this next initiative, which is a really good thing, but it also is you know, oh, how am I going to run? How am I going to create an ESG function? I got that role sort of the same way here. Somebody had to do it. I was a logical choice because I had done a lot of this cross-functional and, to be frank, a lot of our other executives are tied up on other things, so I stepped in to help them so that I could manage this. I have to rely on them for a lot of the work that goes on with ESG. But, being in a company my size, we have 1,500 employees. We are not a 30,000-employee organization, but we're not a small organization, so we have to prioritize our resources and prioritize our approach, which is the best thing I think about how we run ESG and Interfos is we are committed to making things better for our employees, making our company the best it can be and, you know, driving our core values, but at the same time, we have to prioritize and we have to be practical. We don't just do ESG for ESG sake. We do it in a way that really helps the company. We try and find ESG solutions that actually improve the company's performance. That you know, we don't just do. You know, if we have 10 different ESG options, we don't pick all 10 of them just because that's what ESG wants. We take the ones that really help the company and then the ones we can't. We are humble about there's certain things we can do and there's certain things we can't, and I really think the ESG world is going through that kind of transition right now.

Speaker 3: 23:35

There's the you know, the focus on things that are important. You know making sure you treat your employees with respect. Make sure you everybody is given a fair shake. You know you pay everybody correctly. Try and treat you know everybody how they would want to be treated right. That's a very important goal and there's no one solution to that and I think that's what's great about what's going on in the ESG world now is they're having to come up with. There's lots of ways to treat an employee with respect. There's not just one way, there's not just one policy, there's not just one approach to treating your employees with respect, and so the same thing with environmental and with governance. Governance you have to be ethical and you have to be good stewards of the company, but you don't have to just do this one policy. This is the only way to do governance right.

Speaker 3: 24:23

We have to find lots of different solutions and I love doing that from that cross-functional approach. So I you know, I love being in charge of the ESG group, but not because I'm a huge ESG evangelist. I love it because it helps me get to a business solution sometimes and it helps me feel good about I'm really helping the employees, I'm helping our stakeholders and I'm not losing focus on the company has to make money. You can't do ESG and then have the company not make money. Right, you have to find the solution to both at the same time. If you don't, you don't have a company, you have no ESG because you don't have a company to run. Same time, if you don't, you don't have a, you have no ESG because you don't have a company to run. So you have to take that practical approach.

Speaker 3: 25:04

You know, I stole a line from our commercial team and our our company, some of our board members early on is you know you come with a, with any type of solution it's not just ESG and they say you know, you present what you're doing and then the response is that's great, when will it make us money? Right, and so I love that response because it just helps you focus at the end of the day, like, we want to help the environment and we want to do right, but we also have to make sure the company makes money. So and I refuse to believe you can't do both right, you can't be a good environmental steward and also make money Right environmental steward and also make money right. But it's not easy sometimes. You have to really work hard at it. You can't just say I'm just going to do this for environmental sake or for governance sake, right, you have to really think about it and work hard. And then you have to remember at the end of the day, we have to make money.

Speaker 3: 25:52

So I love that transition that I feel is going on with the ESG world today and I love how I got to be in charge of it is yeah, I was the only guy really that had the time and could do it, or you know they assigned it to, but you know, our whole ESG team is a cross-functional approach. Nobody really is, you know, in charge of ESG. We all work together and I try and lead the team just to make sure we stay on track and get what we need to get done. So again, another great example of where you can just you can solve a problem, you know and you can do. You get that 80% or 90% solution if you just, you know, start from a different perspective as you're embarking on the task.

Speaker 2: 26:35

And to be open to taking on new challenges, which it sounds like you are. We are already coming towards the end of this particular conversation, josh, so I'm just going to have to get you on again in the future, because I had a whole bunch of other questions. Just two more for you today, if you don't mind. The next one, let's talk about mentorship. Mentorship is something that you're passionate about, particularly through your work with Women Unlimited. Passionate about particularly through your work with Women Unlimited, josh. Why is mentorship important to you and what role does it play in your leadership philosophy?

Speaker 3: 27:08

Well, mentorship's important to me. One just because I've had some pretty good mentors during my career. I you know, when I was first starting as a lawyer, I had a really great mentor who helped me focus on just looking at a contract. And he not to belabor the story, but he helped me just identify. The first thing he asked me is what's the most important thing in a contract? And I remember saying, oh, it's all these legal provisions. And he said, no, it's the price. Stupid. He said if you don't get that right in the contract, your client doesn't care what the rest of the contract says. Right, and it's not just about putting the right number in the contract not to get too far in the weeds, but there's all the language around the price and how it's calculated, how the defined terms in the contract, right. So I remember that mentor my whole career. I've been a lawyer for 22 years now and so I keep that in the back of my mind and it applies to different aspects as well. So when I had the opportunity to work with Women Unlimited, I thought it was. It's just amazing. I've always found that being a mentor, I actually get more. I get more out of it than the mentees right and I learn about them. I learn what they're doing and I've been able to apply that here at Interfax.

Speaker 3: 28:21

We have a mentor program here at Interfax, but one of the unique programs I think that we put together is I put together, we call it our English Spanish buddy program and basically all it is is we have a lot of employees in Mexico, we have a lot of employees in the US and Canada in Mexico, we have a lot of employees in the US and Canada, and so what? We? We have a lot of employees in both areas that are trying to learn English or trying to learn Spanish, and all we did was just pair. We set up a program where we pair a US employee or a Canadian employee with an employee in Mexico and both of them teach each other the language right and not unlike a formalistic kind of curriculum, they just have conversations and just talk to each other about different instances where they're working together with you know somebody from you know different parts of the world at the company and they just learn so they may talk about. Well, I'm in this, you know, budget meeting, and we keep talking about this one term and I can't quite figure out the right way to say it in English that I want you to cut costs or I want you to economize there, and that English person or the US or Canadian employee helps the Spanish get out of the awkward phrasing and they just talk to them about it.

Speaker 3: 29:37

It's a low cost, it doesn't cost us really anything. We put the employees together, the employees develop a friendship and a and a you know, a new perspective on on learning the language and at the same time, I think it helps the business because you learn more about what the other employee is doing right, just indirectly, by helping them on their language skills. So I think that's a great example where mentoring has multiple benefits and that's why, as you can tell, I'm pretty passionate about, you know, helping and mentoring as much as we can. Uh, we always need to do more, um, and I, you know I always need to do more of the mentoring or uh, but uh, I really think it's a. It's a great way to help. So, just in all aspects, your career development and the business as well excellent.

Speaker 2: 30:19

Excellent, and just finally for today, josh, how can our listeners connect with you and learn more about what you're getting up to? So is that LinkedIn? Do you want to share your email address? Are you super cool all over TikTok and Instagram and places? Tell us more.

Speaker 3: 30:33

So I am. I'm limited to LinkedIn, so I post a bunch on LinkedIn. I some of these catchphrases that you're hearing here, I've I posted a bunch on LinkedIn, so I post a bunch on LinkedIn. I some of these catchphrases that you're hearing here, I've I posted a bunch on LinkedIn. You know my email address. I'm at joshuahornsteininifoscom and so anytime your listeners want to email me, that's fine as well, and I really appreciate all of the the input.

Speaker 3: 30:59

And I really like hearing the stories of when you know, when I connect on LinkedIn, where the somebody says I had the same exact experience or I had the same you know instance where I, you know, I couldn't figure out how to do it and your, your post really gave me a different way of looking at it. So I love to hear stories of where you know, especially where you kind of that that solution. That's kind of like staring in the face, but it took someone else to kind of you know, point it out to you that I love that as well, and so I look at LinkedIn that way is someone gives you a comment and they say you know, I did this, but did you ever think about it in this aspect? And it's like, of course. Why didn't I think of it that way? So I really like hearing from people on LinkedIn about their stories in the workplace. That's the best way to reach me.

Speaker 2: 31:49

Very good, I sent Joshua a connection request just last week and we are already connected. So there we go, listeners. He is responsive, joshua Hornstein. That just leaves me to say for today thank you very much for being my guest.

Speaker 3: 32:02

Thank you, isbel. Thank you, You're welcome and thank you very much.

Speaker 2: 32:06

And listeners as always. Until next time, happy working.

Speaker 1: 32:13

Thanks for listening to the HR Chat Show. If you enjoyed this episode, why not subscribe and listen to some of the hundreds of episodes published by HR Gazette and remember for what's new in the world of work? Subscribe to the show, follow us on social media and visit hrgazettecom.